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Essence
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Should essence loss affect certain verbs and interactions automatically?
It should affect them, barring any applicable actions or changing results automatically.
35%
 35%  [ 7 ]
It should in rare cases bar them but usually not interfere.
40%
 40%  [ 8 ]
It should be up to the player how to role-play this; the system should not handle it at all.
20%
 20%  [ 4 ]
I have no opinion either way.
5%
 5%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 20

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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Tue Dec 24, 2002 10:46 pm    Post subject: Essence
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Essence is a measure in part of one's morality/humanity. Implanting devices and cybernetics reduces one's essence. This would seem to cause one to become less likely to show emotion or perform certain social actions.

So, would preventing the use of verbs such as SMILE, HUG, etc be reasonable after enough essence is lost, or would this impeded too much on RP freedom?
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Brokyn
LLAMA SECHS


Joined: 19 Oct 2002
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 Post Posted: Tue Dec 24, 2002 11:10 pm    Post subject:
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It should effect some verbs, yes, but only the ones that would generally convey emotion (though you could get around that with the ACT verb, which kind of defeats the purpose since your version of it doesn't set ACT apart from other verbs; ie. with parenthesis).

Once you get completely decked out in implants, and I'm talking about not having a single spot left to put one, you should be SEVERELY hampered in verb choice. Look at Robocop. He couldn't do much more than talk and save the day, all without showing any emotion or doing any action that wasn't necessary (well, he did later on.. but not in the beginning, since the beginnings of all action movies are all about ass kicking).

--William, throwing in his two cents
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Dragoonseal



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 7:09 am    Post subject:
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Not to nitpick, but I think SMILE and HUG were bad examples <g>. I don't think someone could ever not smile, and you'd have to be pretty messed up to not be able to hug someone.

I am extremely for implants messing with/helping with/just making different verbs though. Just as much as I am for race effecting the majority of verbs.
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Brokyn
LLAMA SECHS


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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 1:07 pm    Post subject:
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Well. Instead of keeping you from performing verbs like HUG and SMILE, why not just modify them if someone had a certain amount of essence taken up? Like...

>Bob attempts to hug Sue, though it's obvious there's a little awkwardness in his motions.

Or..

>Bob offers an obviously forced smile.

Heh. I think that's what you were talking about in the second half of your post, though..

--William
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 3:29 pm    Post subject:
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Quote:
Not to nitpick, but I think SMILE and HUG were bad examples <g>. I don't think someone could ever not smile, and you'd have to be pretty messed up to not be able to hug someone.

I am extremely for implants messing with/helping with/just making different verbs though. Just as much as I am for race effecting the majority of verbs.


LoL, in other words, you're for the option that definitely creates the most work -- making several instances, more or less, of a large number of verbs. Wink
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Dragoonseal



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 4:28 pm    Post subject:
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Boss Type Guy wrote:
LoL, in other words, you're for the option that definitely creates the most work

Yes Mr. Green
Quote:
-- making several instances, more or less, of a large number of verbs. Wink

Or more <g>. The more the better, its the little things in the game which make it great. Which is why I curse at DR's blatant lack of racial development compared even the simplest of other things.
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 7:21 pm    Post subject:
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I think one has to remember though, that only so much can be done in X time. Because of this, you may truly be faced with the question of "Do we want detailed combat, or detailed social verbs?".

Of course, in DR's case, they've had years to accomplish what they have, and still don't have enough racial development for your liking, it sounds like. Hard to compare to our much shorter dev schedule.

I do want to see detailed socials, probably as much as you do. But I want to see every profession fleshed out, every skill in use, etc. etc. too. So... we'll do our best and then some? Smile
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Dragoonseal



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 7:44 pm    Post subject:
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Boss Type Guy wrote:
So... we'll do our best and then some? Smile

Nein! Nein! Nicht gut genug! *Cracks a whip* Harder! Haaarder!

Boss Type Guy wrote:
Of course, in DR's case, they've had years to accomplish what they have, and still don't have enough racial development for your liking, it sounds like.

Well, basically its like this. Only ways to tell any races apart in anything:

1) Looking at them
2) Prydaen doing ear/tail verbs. (Or Rakash, 1 day out of every 10 days (moonskin), but even then the ungrateful bastards never use the verbs.)

And there you have it. So ya, racial stuff, in a word, sucks.
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HR-Jocelyn



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 8:31 pm    Post subject:
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I'm the type of player who wants verbs as simplistic as possible. I'd vote for a SMILE verb being simply so and so smiles. rather than so and so cracks a huge smile showing his/her teeth.

I believe overly messaged verbs don't do justice to what exactly I want to portray and hate feeling limited by it.

I believe players should be the ones to dictate how their characters respond to various environmental aspects, not the game dictating for them. After all what good is a Role Playing Game if you cant Role Play right? Wink
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Dragoonseal



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 8:39 pm    Post subject:
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Quote:
I believe players should be the ones to dictate how their characters respond to various environmental aspects, not the game dictating for them. After all what good is a Role Playing Game if you cant Role Play right?

There are Prydaens in DR who say no matter what GMs say, they've had children with other races. They of course are still seen as retarded crackpots.

You may not want to have a third arm, but sometimes you just do. You may want to jump just as high as the person twice as tall as you, but sometimes you just can't.

Is there a reason to have different races for anything besides racial stat modifiers or not?
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HR-Jocelyn



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 9:34 pm    Post subject:
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A GM can sit and plan and write as much history/social culture as they want into a race/class/game, but who decides how it actually unfolds or comes to play is the players.

My biggest example of this...in DR Elotheans were supposed to be a virutally completely hairless race, yet I can swear to you that less than 10% of them are actually hairless, in fact it seemed that most of the ones I met, had extremely long hair.

I feel that limiting the players, causes them to play within a specific view that the planning GM creates, and doesnt allow them the freedom to develop their own social cultures and traditions themselves.

We can say, ok since you're a Darju (and im picking something out of thin air...races aren't my speciality Wink) you're supposed to be agressive, unsocial and "crude". Heck, we can even code it so that Darju can't smile, they belch randomly, and they are twice as agressive...But that doesnt help the one person who wants to play the "ousider", the one Darju who wishes to be everything they aren't supposed to be.

You limit what people can/cant do, you limit their roleplaying opportunities, their creativity, and their ability to think for themselves.
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Dragoonseal



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 10:03 pm    Post subject:
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Quote:
My biggest example of this...in DR Elotheans were supposed to be a virutally completely hairless race, yet I can swear to you that less than 10% of them are actually hairless, in fact it seemed that most of the ones I met, had extremely long hair.

And if there were mechanics in place to restrict this, then there wouldn't be this problem. Instead they decided to let have the same hair choices as anyone else.

Quote:
But that doesnt help the one person who wants to play the "ousider", the one Darju who wishes to be everything they aren't supposed to be.

Its not sposed to help. If they want to RP a nice and friendly Darju (there's going to be way too many of these people, mark my word) then they're gonna need to work at it some. This should not an easy thing (though it will be).

If someone wants having plain normal verbs just because, then they can be a human. If not, then they're gonna have to live with being different.
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 11:51 pm    Post subject:
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Quote:
I'm the type of player who wants verbs as simplistic as possible. I'd vote for a SMILE verb being simply so and so smiles. rather than so and so cracks a huge smile showing his/her teeth.


This brings up a point. I recently asked one of our staff who is already editing verbs for various system issues to remove the facility that allows for SMILE <any text here> so that it acts like ACT. In fact, only the ACT and ACTS verbs will do this once he's done.

Originally my thought was that the extra layer of potential in these verbs was harmless and may be useful to some. But I'm realizing that it isn't harmless -- it's confusing. Some verbs you can totally mess up what you're trying to do with a typo or just not using the verb right.

Since ACT and ACTS do not have the parenthesis familiar to GS/DR/HX, you have that as a completely tool for things you'd use SMILE for in that fashion, anyway.
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Dragoonseal



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 Post Posted: Wed Dec 25, 2002 11:52 pm    Post subject:
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Quote:
My biggest example of this...in DR Elotheans were supposed to be a virutally completely hairless race, yet I can swear to you that less than 10% of them are actually hairless, in fact it seemed that most of the ones I met, had extremely long hair.

And if there were mechanics in place to restrict this, then there wouldn't be this problem. Instead they decided to let have the same hair choices as anyone else.

Quote:
But that doesnt help the one person who wants to play the "ousider", the one Darju who wishes to be everything they aren't supposed to be.

Its not sposed to help. If they want to RP a nice and friendly Darju (there's going to be way too many of these people, mark my word) then they're gonna need to work at it some. This should not an easy thing (though it will be).

If someone wants having plain normal verbs just because, then they can be a human. If not, then they're gonna have to live with being different.
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Thu Dec 26, 2002 12:25 am    Post subject:
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BTW, I don't think anyone, even Jocelyn there <grin>, is against some racial differences. The issue is how much is too much, and you both have very different answers probably.

Right now, small differences exist. For example, an Alteri cannot bite their nails via EAT <their name> because they have no nails. Neither Alteri or Jaddan will have hair verbs available, or will have weird messaging if anything.

With the system for smokables Zoz did, each race handles smokes differently.. not only in how gracefully they exhale like DR, but also in how well they can deal with smoke in general.

As we go along, race stuff is being put in there. I don't know if it will match your standards tho, Dragoonseal, or if so, if it will be at release, or later.
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