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Rare Pulse Weapons
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Tao



Joined: 19 Nov 2002
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 Post Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 2:45 am    Post subject:
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Trevor wrote:
Arden does, she's your guru. But I can answer this one for ya.


So Sir Drake is only the temporary Tech Guru? Or are ya saying that Techs get 2 Gurus? Yes, two gurus! Heh.
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2004 11:47 am    Post subject:
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That was posted 7/13... before Arden left the position. Drake is your full time guru.
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dragonseyes



Joined: 01 Sep 2004
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 2:44 am    Post subject:
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SoulTorn wrote:
Just a quick note. The Rtuzma heavy pulse gun works just peachy.

-Chris


If you really think the Rtuzma pulse rifle works nice, train marksmanship up and try out the TG10 shotgun. I would even loan you mine so you don't have to spend the money. I am afraid there's NO comparison. I was getting to tired from the Pulse rifle, but now that I am using the shotgun, or even the spreadshot rifle, I am finding that I hardly get tired. Of course, I also have upped my stat's since then, so I will try it again, and repost if I find I am out of line. I was just getting so tired, from using the pulse rifle, that i was getting hit. ALot.
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soundless
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Joined: 22 May 2004
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 4:48 am    Post subject:
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Non-pulse and pulse weapons are completely different beasts, so it's slightly unfair to compare a shotgun to a pulse rifle.
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dragonseyes



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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:22 am    Post subject:
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soundless wrote:
Non-pulse and pulse weapons are completely different beasts, so it's slightly unfair to compare a shotgun to a pulse rifle.


I really beg to differ. In fact, in my oppinion, other then the technical operation of said equipment's charges/ammo, and MAYBE nature of actual attack, they are both the exact same things. You have a long barrel. You have a trigger. Timmy from southpark sticks one end of either in his ear, and pulls the trigger, and his brains come out the other ear. So you should have to know electronics to use a pulse rifle. In my personal, and granted, not much counted oppinion, there should be no pulse skill at all, because the actual fighting is done in just about every way the same as with a marksmanship weapon. The big difference is the Cores. You can get a Pulse rifle with five thousand charges. When you fire this particular one, you can fire 3 times, and then you have to let it "Cool/recharge" It has a 1 second roundtime per shot. With a shotgun, you have 10 "Shells" that go into it, and you have to reload when that's done. It has a 10 second roundtime for the shotgun reload. And last but not least, you have to aim them. Now, I will say this, I don't know what kind of range the Pulse rifle, versus the Shotgun will have. So that is another issue, but I always try to make sure that the downsides to my arguement are given too. If I am stepping on any toes, I am sorry. I WOULD like to understand the full theory behind a "Pulse rifle" It's not a laser, or it would make holes, not knock stuff down. And the fact that a Gridgun get's less accurate, says that it project SOME kind of solid charge, because a simple electronic pulse would never cause a kick enough that a strong person couldn't keep it centered on an aimed target. Thank you.
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soundless
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 5:35 am    Post subject:
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dragonseyes wrote:
I really beg to differ. In fact, in my oppinion, other then the technical operation of said equipment's charges/ammo, and MAYBE nature of actual attack, they are both the exact same things.


Oh, well as long as we're not considering what they are, how they work, or what they use, yeah, they're exactly the same.
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dragonseyes



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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 6:03 am    Post subject:
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soundless wrote:
dragonseyes wrote:
I really beg to differ. In fact, in my oppinion, other then the technical operation of said equipment's charges/ammo, and MAYBE nature of actual attack, they are both the exact same things.


Oh, well as long as we're not considering what they are, how they work, or what they use, yeah, they're exactly the same.


Pulse Rifle. Shotgun. They are weapons. They appraise as fireing weapons. It would be like saying a Shotgun is not like a handgun, which you will note are both marksmanship weapons, because one uses a solid slug, while the other uses a handful of smaller, differently shaped particles.

They work like guns, something comes out one end, and you point that end at what you want dead, and pull the trigger. Don't forget to aim both of them, or you might not hit.

As far as exactly what a pulse rifle uses, I know it's some kind of energy charge, but it's at least partially physical, as simple energy will not have a kick.

I am not going to respond to this again, unless asked to by either a Moderator, or a leader, in any fashion.
P.S. I don't mind being proven wrong, just don't give me this as long as we ignore everything, they are the same. GIVE DETAILS. I did, please reciprocate if you disagree with me.
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soundless
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 6:28 am    Post subject:
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What is the difference between the two?

HR-Trevor wrote:
Marksmanship:
- more power per shot, especially for rifles/shotguns.
- cheaper to upgrade.
- opponent's armor is less useful vs. firearms than it is vs. pulse, usually.
- less common (if this is a perk to you).

Pulse:
- virtually unlimited ammo, no real need to reload (you do reload every several thousand shots).
- some fire many shots once.
- some (ionic / multiphase) can pass right through certain armors (telyron, etc. -- more conventional armors).
- Very little ammo needed, vs. firearms which require a constant supply of ammo which can be heavy to carry.


But isn't marksmanship something everyone aiming a weapon would be interested in?

HR-Trevor wrote:
Marksmanship purely applies to all things related to conventional non-pulse firearms.


The following was an old post, and I cut out the stuff I believe Trevor changed/tweaked. I also cut out what just isn't an actual factor in the game yet (ie: weapon and ammo creation systems).
HR-Trevor wrote:
Firearms:

The Good:
- Does not require close range.
- A variety of ammunition types are available.
- Capable of firing multiple shots quickly before reloading is required.
- Generally produces high damage.
- Has a high potential to stun wounded targets.
- May be equiped with accessories to improve performance.
- Counter abilities/armors/spells such as Static Cloak are ineffective.

The Bad:
- Both weapons and ammunition are expensive.
- Somewhat low accuracy and dark conditions significantly reduce accuracy as well.
- Armored targets may be mostly unphased by hits if low penetration ammunition is used.
- Weapons may jam or misfire.
- Recoil causes low accuracy in automatic firearms.

Notes:
- Rifles do not suffer accuracy penalties at longer ranges.
- Shotguns receive -1 Damage/Accuracy/Stun at missile range, +1 to each at Melee.

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Pulse Weapons:

The Good:
- Does not require close range.
- Is equally accurate and powerful at close or far ranges.
- Capable of firing a very high number of shots before recharging or cooling are necessary.
- Fires very rapidly.
- May be equiped with accessories to improve performance.
- Counter abilities/armors/spells such as Static Cloak are ineffective.

The Bad:
- Weapons are extremely expensive.
- Once recharging or cooling are required, weapon cannot be used for a lengthy period of time.
- Fairly inaccurate.
- Some special armors can greatly resist the effects of non-ionic pulse weapons.
- Poisons, incendiaries and other special modifications may not be applied to this type of weapon.

Notes: Some pulse weapons can fire both standard and ionic pulse, while others only fire one type. Generally an ionic pulse is used to weaken anti-pulse armor, then standard pulse is used to directly damage the target. High grade anti-pulse armors may be virtually impossible to penetrate without using this method.


So, there are different systems and methods used in both conventional long-range weapons and pulse-based.

While you the player see it as a matter of entering AIM and FIRE, your character might not see it as simply. This is similar to how you can enter ATTACK to attack, yet just because it works just as well for blunt weapons as it does bladed, those weapons really are not the same.
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 7:58 am    Post subject:
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One of the advantages of one or the other would be the resistances of what you're fighting. If it has high piercing resist and low electrical, pulse will maul it. The reverse is true for firearms. However, purely ionic weapons like the gridgun/splattergun completely negate armor which is a very powerful aspect. Even tho they have weaker hits, the armor negation and multi shots makes them quite formidable.

However, quite frankly, rarely is anything as effective in causing immediate death than a good shotgun or rifle shot to a vital area. The sheer force they create can wreak havoc on almost any target unless it has unbelievable piercing resist.
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HR-Mickey
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 1:34 pm    Post subject:
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Just a devil's advocate interjection, if projectile a fired from weapon b == gun, what does that say about things like bows? Or slings?
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dragonseyes



Joined: 01 Sep 2004
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 2:14 pm    Post subject:
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Ahh, thank you both. The aspect of the Armor is not something I have yet had to deal with, and so I was not operating with all data. I did try to make sure people knew my view on things was somewhat limited. None the less, that's a really good point, because the Marksmanship firearms have absolutely NO ability to penetrate good armor, unless they are specifically designed as such, and shotguns are not. I still believe that they are fired the same way, in as much as a handgun and a shotgun and a rifle are all fired in the same way. As I work around guns all the time, I can see both points.

As far as a bow and arrow, or a sling, those aren't guns. There's no barrel, and no trigger. And you don't point and click either one. Basically THAT in my oppinion would be like comparing apples and oranges, far more then pulse rifles, and marks rifles. And I am still going to try out a pulse rifle to see if my improved stat's have made it any less unwieldy. Thank you all for your time, and attention to detail.

Lastly, I do not see guns as JUST AIM and SHOOT. If you know anything about the real thing, you know that if you fire them, they must then be cleaned. It's not exactly a simple job to completely break down and clean a gun, but if you do it enough, you get fast at it. And to load a shotgun, you either have a clip, or you have space inside the shotgun, depending on what kind. With the pulse, a theoretical weapon, from my experience loading and unloading them, that there is an electronic core that you put in, and it contains "Ammo" and as it is rapid fire, at least those 3 shots are just point and click.
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dragonseyes



Joined: 01 Sep 2004
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 2:50 pm    Post subject:
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I have completed a round of hunting useing the Gridgun. I will again try the pulse rifle also. I must admit, I stayed above 90 SP, where before I was getting down to 50, and starting to get hit, alot. I could balance that by taking regular breaks, and it was working. I just wanted to point out, that as for getting tired, Marks used alot less kills then Pulse. With my gridgun, it averages 3 to 4 shots, where with my shotgun, it averaged 1 to 2. I am certain things will change when I transition to heavier, more armored creatures then Workers, but as of this instant, shotguns are sweet. Just for the record, I brought my vitality and strength from 3, to 10. I figure this has a lot to do with the improvement. I will post the results of my experiments with the Rtuzma pulse rifle.
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dragonseyes



Joined: 01 Sep 2004
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 3:10 pm    Post subject:
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Alright, here it is. When I used the Pulse Rifle, it took more shots, then the shotgun, but for pure killing, I am not as interested in one hit kills, as I am in getting through it alive. With stat's of 10 versus 3, I never got below 90 SP, and it's also possible that my method of hunting previously was also at fault to a degree. I currently use a script, so all my hunting is at a relaxed, don't fire until the shot is read type of pace. It seems to me also, that the strength of the pulse rifle has gone up. It could ALSO be that my Cyber Implants give me a greater chance of doing damage. Either way, I am now willing to say that the Rtuzma rifle works fine, but only after you raise your stat's from their starting levels for a tech. Yes, I am admitting I may not have been as Accurate in my estimation as I could have been.
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HR-Marduk



Joined: 11 Apr 2004
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 3:25 pm    Post subject:
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Pretty much any data you get on ranged weapons right now is going to be obsolete in a month or so.
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Tao



Joined: 19 Nov 2002
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 Post Posted: Mon Sep 13, 2004 4:31 pm    Post subject:
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Armat M41A Pulse Rifle
Type: Assault Carbine
Calibre: 99 M309 10mm x 24 HEAP, 4 M40 30mm HEF
1st Fn: Semi-Automatic, 4 Round Pulse Burst, Full Automatic 900 RPM
2nd Fn: Single-Shot HEF
Weight: 4.9kg
Length: 69.5cm

Since it was introduced, the Armat M41A has become the standard weapon of the USCMC. Its name is derived from its electronic, pulse action firing system.

Although its called a pulse rifle, this baby uses bullets.

Uncle Marduk, can I have one of these? Pwease? Very Happy
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Last edited by Tao on Mon Sep 13, 2004 4:47 pm; edited 2 times in total
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