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lets quell this
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The Official Haelrahv Message Forum Forum Index » Player-Created Polls » lets quell this
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Would you rather the game be...
Totaly realistic
4%
 4%  [ 1 ]
More realistic
9%
 9%  [ 2 ]
As is
52%
 52%  [ 11 ]
More fantasy
28%
 28%  [ 6 ]
Total fantasy
4%
 4%  [ 1 ]
Total Votes : 21

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Mischeif



Joined: 26 Sep 2003
Posts: 277

 Post Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 2:38 pm    Post subject: lets quell this
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time to put this to rest. this will run for a week.
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Downtweak



Joined: 14 Mar 2003
Posts: 389
Location: West of October

 Post Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 4:20 pm    Post subject:
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Filled with gratuitous amounts of hot girl-on-girl action.
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ethrstorm
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Joined: 05 Jul 2003
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 Post Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 5:50 pm    Post subject:
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I picked the more fantasy side. I'm sure many of you if you wanted it to be more realistic would stop playing and do the actual reality stuff <can't get any more realistic then stepping away from the computer and engaging in face to face chit chat>. Besides that it's fun when it doesn't really make that much sense. Why make it upsetting when it starts to make sense.
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SolitaryTurnip



Joined: 17 Jul 2003
Posts: 1724
Location: Your mom (burn)

 Post Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 5:59 pm    Post subject:
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I think it's good how it is... I don't get how it can be "more fantasy." You mean like, talking swords and stuff like that?
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senseandviolets



Joined: 22 Jun 2003
Posts: 358
Location: Land of the lizards.

 Post Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 6:47 pm    Post subject:
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I don't quite get what this survey is asking... I believe the "reality" elements enhance and are even necessary to a fantasy game. Sculpting, photography, fishing, and tailoring as well as alchemy and combat to a certain extent are all "realistic" systems. I woudln't find life in HR as fun if they were reduced to a 1-step "magic" trick. I think the two work as compliments to one another.

Sure it's a "fantasy/sci fi" game but I take that as more of an environment issue. There's not much in the way of cybergear, people being brought back to life from cardio stimulation, or multiple sentient races in the real world... but that doesn't mean they work/exist against all natural logic either.
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Brenton
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Joined: 05 Jul 2003
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 Post Posted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:03 pm    Post subject:
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I wish Bashy talked =\
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Tylen
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Joined: 29 Jul 2003
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 Post Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 4:16 am    Post subject:
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senseandviolets wrote:
I don't quite get what this survey is asking... I believe the "reality" elements enhance and are even necessary to a fantasy game. Sculpting, photography, fishing, and tailoring as well as alchemy and combat to a certain extent are all "realistic" systems. I woudln't find life in HR as fun if they were reduced to a 1-step "magic" trick. I think the two work as compliments to one another.

Sure it's a "fantasy/sci fi" game but I take that as more of an environment issue. There's not much in the way of cybergear, people being brought back to life from cardio stimulation, or multiple sentient races in the real world... but that doesn't mean they work/exist against all natural logic either.


I pretty much agree with this.

Does the game need to be more like real life? No.

But Haelrahv needs many more of the details of a real world. The calendar, pantheons, lists of gems/plants/metals/woods, etc., are all a good start. But what's the population of Llanfair and the entire planet? What does Eolaish look/sound like, and why is it superior to the other languages?

One of the things I like about DR is all the effort they put into the magic rewrite and Magic Theory. Do mages/psionics here even really understand how their spells work?

There are so many things that could be added to make the game more "real" while not making it any less "fantasy."
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Downtweak



Joined: 14 Mar 2003
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Location: West of October

 Post Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 4:24 am    Post subject:
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Quote:
One of the things I like about DR is all the effort they put into the magic rewrite and Magic Theory. Do mages/psionics here even really understand how their spells work?

There are so many things that could be added to make the game more "real" while not making it any less "fantasy."


While things like this are nice, I feel that, especially in the case of magic theory in DR, it's incredibly easy to write yourself into a corner, where you end up following your own made-up rules instead of doing what's best for gameplay.
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HR-Trevor
Boss Type Guy


Joined: 04 Oct 2002
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 Post Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 8:45 am    Post subject:
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I think this poll could be better categorized as "more realistic" versus "less realistic". An example: Being able to dodge bullets is realistically very very very hard and more luck than skill. You can duck under cover, but in a fully real game you'd have to locate cover and duck under it before the shot was made. In a somewhat real game you have some chance of automatically dodging it and it's just assumed you ducked under cover or happened to move at the right time. In a less realistic game you're able to dodge bullets virtually as well as other attacks, so as to not make guns too powerful. We would fall under that third category in this example.

Now, as to magic theory, I agree with Neifl. As soon as you start to define where magic comes from, you are forever forced to use those guidelines for future considerations of magic. For example, if we say it is some force that exists on/in Haelrahv itself (which would be a handy reason to explain why there's no fireball wielding mages on Earth!) then we have to think... well what happens when players can go to another planet, or into space in general, or even another plane of existence?

Certainly we do need to flesh this stuff out more. One of the things that has plagued us as a staff is trying to assemble and keep a good history team. It's sort of a joke that we're cursed there, because every history team that forms falls apart soon thereafter (case in point, none of the former seven people who did history stuff are on staff today).

But... what you're talking about is history and lore, not game mechanics, and I think this poll was made to consider those mechanics more than the world lore itself. Certainly the world lore is the foundation so you can't exclude it, but still, at the lowest level of game design, one of the most critical decisions that must be made is how much realism will factor in decisions as to who can do what.
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drainm2



Joined: 24 Jul 2003
Posts: 125
Location: FL

 Post Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 12:02 pm    Post subject:
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ya know....on a side note...i would be very interested in joining/forming a history team for HR. Several players who know their stuff could get together and see what needs a historical background and what doesnt. Since this is a game for the players with as-little-as-possible admin control, that might work out? If it was every player making contribution to historical background i think things would go haywire and everything would be discombobulated. For that reason it should be an elite-est group who know their stuff and have time to commit
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Tylen
Alpha Antifemale


Joined: 29 Jul 2003
Posts: 1192
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 Post Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 2:43 pm    Post subject:
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Downtweak wrote:
While things like this are nice, I feel that, especially in the case of magic theory in DR, it's incredibly easy to write yourself into a corner, where you end up following your own made-up rules instead of doing what's best for gameplay.


Well it's hard to argue against that without an example. But since it's so incredibly easy I'm sure you can come up with something.

HR-Trevor wrote:
Now, as to magic theory, I agree with Neifl. As soon as you start to define where magic comes from, you are forever forced to use those guidelines for future considerations of magic. For example, if we say it is some force that exists on/in Haelrahv itself (which would be a handy reason to explain why there's no fireball wielding mages on Earth!) then we have to think... well what happens when players can go to another planet, or into space in general, or even another plane of existence?


You either expand the theory to include areas outside Haelrahv, or don't allow magic there. Even better (or at least more interesting) would be to develop completely different theories depending on where you were, although that would end up requiring a lot of effort on the part of the GMs.

HR-Trevor wrote:
But... what you're talking about is history and lore, not game mechanics, and I think this poll was made to consider those mechanics more than the world lore itself. Certainly the world lore is the foundation so you can't exclude it, but still, at the lowest level of game design, one of the most critical decisions that must be made is how much realism will factor in decisions as to who can do what.


Well the poll was set up rather vaguely. I was just bringing up things that could make the game both more "real" and "fantasy" at the same time.
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Downtweak



Joined: 14 Mar 2003
Posts: 389
Location: West of October

 Post Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 3:26 pm    Post subject:
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Quote:
Well it's hard to argue against that without an example. But since it's so incredibly easy I'm sure you can come up with something.


Of course I can. As much as I enjoy debating DR politics, this isn't really the place for it.

I really don't think I need to do anything but point out how horribly MR theory meshed with anything remembling game balance, especially considering certain guilds (read: bards).

Or how indirectly the magic systems placed caps on certain skills and abilities, yet failed to place caps on the skills/abilities which defended against them, based on the fact that it simply didn't make sense in their own self-invented system.

I honestly believe it's much better for gameplay to keep such definitions nebulous, or at least flexible.
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They hate me because I am the accumulation of the knowledge of Death.  That knowledge is a curse to them instead of a useful burden.

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Mischeif



Joined: 26 Sep 2003
Posts: 277

 Post Posted: Sat Feb 28, 2004 9:27 pm    Post subject:
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this is my night to be amused,
i started this poll in reference to someone who redirected another strand saying the game needed to be more realistic, but then here states it doesnt. Confused guess it depends on which side of the keyboard ya wake up on huh Smile
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tygerwulf
Teh Pink Assassin.


Joined: 06 Jul 2003
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 Post Posted: Sat Mar 20, 2004 3:22 am    Post subject:
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I'd just like to say one thing.

Reality is what you make it.
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