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Five Finger Discounts
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Brokyn
LLAMA SECHS


Joined: 19 Oct 2002
Posts: 3648
Location: Northern Georgia

 Post Posted: Thu May 08, 2003 4:55 pm    Post subject: Five Finger Discounts
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I'm a little unsure, but was there any previous speaking of Blackmarkets for the spiffy Agents? If not, here are my ideas (feel free to flame/smite/whatever me if you disagree with them -- this is a collaborative pre-alpha phase, after all). Everything's kind of spur-of-the-moment and out of order, and for that I'm sorry. Hopefully it'll be easy enough to read and comprehend. Also, before the ideas begin, I'll have to preface this by saying that there may be quite a few similarities between this and the Market system from DR -- I seem to have this nasty habit of stealing other peoples' ideas and just.. modifying them. Personal character flaw, I guess.

------------------------------------------

1. If it were up to me, I'd make this an Agent-only "business", simply because they're the more shadowy-inclined and therefore more trustworthy for the market owners. However, if the Alignment system were to come into play, I'd open it up for all non-Good aligned characters, with the more evil ones getting better/fairer deals in the market. The reasoning is pretty obvious, I think. I'm tempted to say that Bureaucrats should get in on this, but something tells me they're going to have plenty of money-making deals as it is.

2. As far as what can be sold at the market, anything should be fair game. It'd pretty much be the standard Pawnshop code, though modified. As to bonuses (ie, the modifications), I would base them heavily on Charisma, as well as one's reputation (including, but not limited to, how many times the Agent/non-good-character has been arrested in whatever span of time; how often the Agent/character is caught stealing from people/shopowners, thus instituting a sort of "Thief Bonus" from that other place, though nothing as horrid as their version; persuasion and/or intimidation; et al)

3. Not only should there be a basic Pawnshop kind of setup, but also an "Arab Bazaar" kind of deal in the back. You can rent a table, place your stolen/bought/tailored/whatever loot on them, set a price (via price tags, like in that other place), and let people buy at their leisure.

4. Since you really wouldn't want to openly advertise to the public that... "I've just rented a table in the blackmarket; come buy my wonderful stolen wares!"... all the time, perhaps (and this is a rather long stretch) have NPC buyers that will randomly buy from the Agent (and yes, Agents should be the only ones able to rent the tables -- sorry). This would be so heavily based on Charisma and Persuasion, though, that not the everyday (under 30th level) Agent will be able to get this event to occur.

5. Going back to the Pawnshop idea, there really shouldn't be a seperate NPC just to buy your stolen goods -- that can be handled by the regular Pawner, who really wouldn't know a stolen glove from a purchased one to begin with. Instead, how about having everything Pawned go somewhat straight to the Blackmarket? The NPC should be smart enough not to put more than one item its tables at once (read: we don't want to see twenty leather gloves on a table when what we need are weapons, jewelry, or whatever).

6. The Black Market, if actually opened to everyone (even the good-aligned characters, if that system comes out), should only allow those over a certain level to access it. I would suggest Fifth, if only because levels are going to take a long time to get in Haelrahv that 5th is probably comparable to DR's 10th circle (if the level calculations stay the same, anyway). This will prevent the lowly throw-away characters from running in and grabbing something for their player's main character -- which leads me to...

7. Given that it's the Black Market, and that it's a fairly shadowy and against-the-law organization, perhaps there should be random police raids where everyone caught would face some serious charges (fees should either be flat across the board for everyone caught in the raid, or should be based on Charisma and persuasion/intimidation.. maybe a little Law check thrown in for good measure?). After each raid, there would be an hour or two where nothing would happen within the Market, but eventually everything would get back to normal. There's too much money to be had in selling stolen goods, so the organizers would make sure that there's a steady income being generated. The reason why it's never permanantly shutdown would be from corruption in the government (...that Alteri mayor does seem to get a new ring every week).

8. Maybe there should be a random movement factor put into the Market, too. By that, I mean that it literally moves around -- be it to another continent, another island, or just to another area on the same continent -- once and awhile (maybe once a week or so). There could be a few NPCs in each continent that have their fingers in every business, so to speak, and would know where the Markets are either heading or are set up. This movement would also help explain why the police raids never effectively shutdown the Market, too.

9. If an Agent were to sell something off of his table, there should definantly be a good amount of experience gained.. depending on the amount the item sold for if it was hand-made, though it should be based on the actual value of the item if it was stolen from a shop. There's no sense in getting 100 experience for selling both a "capped" handbow and bought handbow (assuming that shops won't sell the really top-of-the-line items that characters can make).

10. There isn't really a tenth idea.. I just wanted to round out my list with an even number. Yee.

------------------------------------------

Enjoy.

--William
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Mausumi



Joined: 11 Mar 2003
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 Post Posted: Fri May 09, 2003 1:29 am    Post subject:
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Interesting, it almost sounds like a combo of the "Bazaar tables"/Pawn Shop from DR. In fact, yeah, you basically said that.

I rather like the idea, though, I'm curious. Would the black market tables be limited to just stolen goods? It seems like it'd be fair to also put the "massively rare" or "extremely useful but difficult to get (aka, legally get)" stuff also on the tables. More likely to draw attention to it and all that...

And I'm tired so I'll have to reread it again tomorrow to fully understand the second half. I sorta spaced out about halfway...

~Keahi
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Brokyn
LLAMA SECHS


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 Post Posted: Fri May 09, 2003 5:42 am    Post subject:
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Quote:
Would the black market tables be limited to just stolen goods?


I wouldn't think so, if only because I think it'd be quite the ordeal to put in code that'd track every and all stolen goods in the game. I'm also starting to have my doubts on who should get to "own" the Black Markets... Bureaucrats and Agents both kind of have their foot in the door, if that makes sense. If they both were allowed to operate within the Market, I don't think it'd be too insane -- Agents would probably have the more common things, anyway, from their looting sprees; Bureaucrats would probably have the harder-to-find stuff, given that they'd probably get a discount on it if they bought it from a shop (Charisma and overall profession bonus, I think).

I.. don't know anymore.

--William

PS: Anyone else notice how I seem to act like I'm an official in all my threads? Embarassed
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HR-Morrigan



Joined: 06 Sep 2002
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Location: Trooper Tower, Titan City

 Post Posted: Fri May 09, 2003 7:50 am    Post subject:
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Quote:
I'm also starting to have my doubts on who should get to "own" the Black Markets... Bureaucrats and Agents both kind of have their foot in the door, if that makes sense.


And can't forget about those Artisans that would rather broker in stolen goods than created artwork Wink Although, personally I don't really see it being "owned" by any one profession, seems like something that most could utilize. I can see certain professions could have a bonus to using it.

Oh and I like the idea of having it move around, wouldn't be as fun for Troopers to raid the same spot everytime Twisted Evil
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Fri May 09, 2003 11:49 am    Post subject:
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If something like this were to be implemented, I would wager it would be more tied in with the Streetwise skill than anything else, which means Agents would specialize in but not own the ability. Thanks for the ideas Smile
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Brokyn
LLAMA SECHS


Joined: 19 Oct 2002
Posts: 3648
Location: Northern Georgia

 Post Posted: Fri May 09, 2003 3:15 pm    Post subject:
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Sorry, I'm still trapped within the mindset that every guild/profession practically owns its own spiffy systems. Stupid Simutronics. They shall be smote by the end of the year, this I vow.

--William
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HR-Trevor
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 Post Posted: Fri May 09, 2003 3:51 pm    Post subject:
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<grin> well they do own some stuff, but not like say DR or GS Wink
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